I think the angels' ability to take a body is quite literally dependent upon the person saying, "Yes."
You're right, of course. I still wanted to brain Zach for it ;-)
I don't believe for a minute that Jimmy gave informed consent or that Claire was remotely capable of giving consent,
This also raises a question - if this thing about needing minimal consent (ie, the word "yes", if nothing else), Castiel MUST have approached Claire at some point. Given that she probably realised that it was the only way she was going to save her family, I guess she wouldn't have thought too hard about it. Yet again, I guess, we're getting into "consent under duress", but we've discussed that one. Claire's reaction after Cas leaves her body is also pretty telling, the poor kid is pretty traumatised. Yes, she's witnessed her mother possessed and has been kidnapped, etc, but I don't think that's all of it.
The implication here is that Dean knows, in some way, what it is like to be "taken" and "ridden" and he knows that it broke him eleven years ago - to give up to Michael now would, perhaps, bring him back to Hell, at least mentally.
Yes definitely. And if we add that to the fact that he finally seems to have learned his lesson - emphatically - when it comes to dealing with the angels, it's really no surprise that he refused even in the face of losing Sam and Bobby. He finally understands that nothing is worth the surrender of self that they are demanding, and the fact that there's probably an awful lot they're not telling him.
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Date: 2009-09-14 01:51 am (UTC)You're right, of course. I still wanted to brain Zach for it ;-)
I don't believe for a minute that Jimmy gave informed consent or that Claire was remotely capable of giving consent,
This also raises a question - if this thing about needing minimal consent (ie, the word "yes", if nothing else), Castiel MUST have approached Claire at some point. Given that she probably realised that it was the only way she was going to save her family, I guess she wouldn't have thought too hard about it. Yet again, I guess, we're getting into "consent under duress", but we've discussed that one. Claire's reaction after Cas leaves her body is also pretty telling, the poor kid is pretty traumatised. Yes, she's witnessed her mother possessed and has been kidnapped, etc, but I don't think that's all of it.
The implication here is that Dean knows, in some way, what it is like to be "taken" and "ridden" and he knows that it broke him eleven years ago - to give up to Michael now would, perhaps, bring him back to Hell, at least mentally.
Yes definitely. And if we add that to the fact that he finally seems to have learned his lesson - emphatically - when it comes to dealing with the angels, it's really no surprise that he refused even in the face of losing Sam and Bobby. He finally understands that nothing is worth the surrender of self that they are demanding, and the fact that there's probably an awful lot they're not telling him.